I’m having some trouble here lately coming up with a reason for the secrecy of magick. I know…I know…magick’s supposed to be kept in secret so that people who aren’t worthy of the power won’t get it… The only question I have is, “Do you know anyone who, after spending 10 years on a magickal path has less of a right to this supposed ‘power’ than you do?” I know that I’ve spent a lot of work getting to where I am, and I don’t think any government officials are worried about what I’m doing. I agree that we don’t want a bunch of crazies doing serious curse work, but then again, if they’re smart enough to get to that point then they’re probably going to get the information regardless. I guess that if we kept it in covens or groups where someone could weed out the crazies then it would work out, but how many of you have stayed in a single coven for your entire magickal career?
What I’m asking is for a true reason for the secrecy. I personally think that there are a lot of good reasons why it was hidden (persecution, wanting all of the power to themselves, solitaries wishing to learn rather than teach), but why do people want it hidden now? The secret’s out kids, Wicca is a recognized religion. People are very aware that there are people walking around calling themselves witches and magicians (though most of them think we should be taking crazy pills). Very few, if any, Pagans want the books to stop being published or for Barnes and Nobles to stop selling Tarot decks or for those rare Metaphysical stores to all be shut down. So why are so many people up in arms against anything that resembles being public about our beliefs?
So after all of that, I would like to know if there is really any valid reason why people should keep their practices secret. I feel like I may be missing something because everything I’ve ever thought about magick is always steeped in secrecy, but I just can’t logically come up with a reason. I know that individual rituals or ceremonies shouldn’t be talked about due to the leaking of power, but should the basic ideas behind rituals be made public? If there is an organization that is pushing for Pagan equality, they’re going to have to explain what exactly it is that we believe and how it works. So do we downplay things or do we be straight-up with them and explain what we do? Or do we just tell them to read a Silver Ravenwolf book (which I’m absolutely not saying in a sarcastic manner, it’s just that she writes in a very easy to understand language for people with no background)?
Hi there.
I’m sorry, but am I missing something? I thought that this stuff is public. Am I wrong? I have at least 20 books on Wiccan and Pagan religions and magic. I also have many people I talk to about the basic stuff other than joining a coven. Is this not the norm? If this stuff is still all secretive, then how is it a recognized religion, and how are so many people coming into this religion? Correct me if I’m wrong, please. I read your blog about the schools. Is this what you are referring to? The fact that there are no schools out there to teach the Wiccan way? If I remember correctly, the way you described how the schools would have to be set up and run, it would be quite hard. Like finding teachers, paying teachers, etc.
I also do not quite understand this:
“If there is an organization that is pushing for Pagan equality, they’re going to have to explain what exactly it is that we believe and how it works.”
I din’t know we were deprived of any rights… And why wouldn’t we just be able to explain what we believe? Ok. So we don’t explain it. Then what? They pick up a book, and figure it out themselves. That’s what most people do when they are researching a group or organization, right? They research it.
Please let me know if I am totally not getting what you were shooting for in this blog. I’m a bit confused.
I believe that it should be up to the individual whether or not they should be open about being wiccan. I myself have a hard time telling someone because I have told my dad and he’s telling me that he doesn’t think it is right and that’s fine that’s his belief;however, lately it seems like he is trying to push his beliefs on me which makes me wonder whether or not I should have told him. I do however tell people that I could possibly be with that I am wiccan because I can’t keep that from someone. I need people to accept me for who I am and that is part of me. Also I don’t think it is in secret the way it used to be. I think that maybe some people hide it to avoid being persecuted for who they are.
So do I think that it should be kept secret…….Well like I said earlier I think it depends on what the person wants. I believe that if someone does want to learn, then they need to be aware of the wiccan rede. I myself will never do any kind of harmful magick.
So I guess I wrote a rather confusing blog now that I reread it. The point of the blog was not whether or not we should keep the fact that we’re Pagan secret, and it was not whether or not we should keep the beliefs secret. It was more about how everything in every book pushes us to be slightly secretive, how the idea of magick is enveloped in secrecy, and how people continuously have told me that we needed to stay slightly secretive. I was asking if there was really any reason why we should stay secretive.
“If there is an organization that is pushing for Pagan equality, they’re going to have to explain what exactly it is that we believe and how it works.”
About this statement: there are still a lot of misconceptions and distrust to people who are Pagan. Children are labeled “freaks” for wearing a pentagram and many Christian children are not allowed to play with children who are Pagan. Just two nights ago while helping a friend move had an experience where simply for saying I was Agnostic, I was looked down upon, and these were childhood friends. I have no idea what they would have said had I said I was Pagan.
I absolutely think that people should be able to say they’re Pagan without any more stigma than someone saying they’re gay. Yes, we are different from the norm and so there will be some stigma, but it shouldn’t be quite the same as it is now. I would be very very uncomfortable wearing a pentagram to work as an engineer, and promotions would probably pass me by quite often if I did. I don’t want this to be the case any more.
I know that there are thousands of books on Paganism out there, and anyone can go pick them up and read them, but if an organization is making any kind of political moves at all, there will be direct questions. So should we say, “We believe in the fact that people can manifest their desires through certain ritualized ceremonies much like Catholic masses,” or should we intricately describe things? Yes, anyone can go research it, but as a somewhat politically controversial organization, should we dumb it down for them and explain everything to them? Should we make an intro book that’s 30 pages long that’s super short and to the point for the American public? Or should we say, “Just go read a book from your local Barnes and Nobles, or Half Price”?
I don’t know if this cleared anything up, but sorry for the super ambiguous post. It’s been a very eventful day today, and I had trouble concentrating on the blog.
its a tough call. I’m not sure if any christian would WANT to read a “pagan pamphlet” or any other person of a different religion. I was raised up in a southern baptist house hold where every thing was “hell this” and “brimstone that”. i was able to get out of that oppressive religion with the help of some pagan friends of mine. which brings the point of an informational book or what not. if i had never met those people, i would not have ever known about Wicca. So, what about those who WANT to break way to a religion better suited to them? i guess i have to conclude with: if knowledge is power, make it easy to obtain.
I think specific ceremonies, spells, rituals should be kept secret for the sake of containing the power of it. And I know that’s not what you are talking about.
I think our religious beliefs should be public, or publicly available, b/c that’s how people discover that they are pagan– they stumble upon something that makes them identify more closely with who they are who they want to be. But those are just the beliefs, not techniques, and ultimately it should be perfectly acceptable for people to know that we believe in nature, cycles, etc. etc.
I think there are many, many techniques, effective and useless, that are published in mass quantity and can be found on any New Age book shelf or on the internet at any time. It’s just that we are only 1.5% of the population (pagans) so only those who are looking for the techniques or those who occasionally are looking for controversy will ever stumble upon them.
But what if there was something especially powerful, something out of the movies, like time travel or demon summoning with all the sparks and sound effects? I think if someone discovered that technique then maybe they are not the kind of person to keep it quiet for any good reason (they did after all, summon demons).
Ultimately, I think it must be on a case by case basis and we have to trust that whoever is worthy of the information will stumble upon it. “When the student is ready the teacher appears.” So, when the magician is ready the spell will find her and that means we can release it or not, publish it or not and it will go where it is supposed to go. Maybe that’s too ideal, but really– some things would be like giving a 100 lb. weight to a baby– if the strength, coordination and skill are not there to lift it then it just sits there. If someone comes across a book of shadows most likely they will either have what it takes to have an effective outcome or they won’t and the content of the book of shadows will be only mildly influential.
In my opinion, the idea that magick is somehow more powerful if it is kept secret is ridiculous. Furthermore, experimentation shows that there’s no difference between a well-known magical formula and a “secret” one in terms of practical effectiveness. It is far more beneficial to the science and art of magick to publicize techniques and especially practical results so that we can build up an overall knowledge base. People who cling to secrecy seriously impede this from happening.
The idea of “unworthy” people using magick is also something that I find kind of silly. Magick is only partly based on technique. There are plenty of books around that publish the katas of Karate, for example, and yet you don’t see idiots running around and using them to beat people up. They just don’t work without sustained, disciplined practice, and magick is the same way. By the time you are able to sustain a disciplined practice, you generally aren’t interested in, say, running around cursing everybody or whatever it is the pro-secrecy folks are worrying about.
Magical instruction itself is not dangerous and should be publicized. If you try a spell that’s far beyond your ability the usual result is that nothing happens and you wind up feeling a little silly for dancing around in a robe and shouting or whatever. Supposed “spell backfires” are for the most part urban legends, and can pretty easily be explained by how common mental illness is rather than anything linked to the practice of magick or ritual.
Hi again, I’ve noticed that, obviously you are very frustrated. I can definitely understand your feelings, as I grew up in a very religious family(Christian), but at the same time they practiced magick…spells, rituals, chants, talismans….the whole gammit. So, please understand my position when I make the statement that, things are waaay more complicated, in my understanding and opinion, than what it is that we see everyday and experience from daily christians. It is my firm belief that many so-called christians are in fact practicing magick regularly, as well as the establishment also. It started as basically a “gut” feeling, a basic understanding. As I have done more research and taken more study, I catch phrases from people and “see” more. As an example, pay attention to what is in the news…catch phrases, “talking points”, saying of the day, things of that sort even new science discoveries point to things that were understood thousands of years ago by magicians…you’ll start to notice that these sayings are also in movies, also in books. My point of that is, I would not consider myself pagan so to speak also, I would not say that I am Christian either, I just don’t fit in either of those worlds, yet I apply to my daily thoughts and living elements of both, as a matter of fact many people do, but the sticking point for them is the simple question: how do you define yourself? they feel they must define themselves by religion as well as job or community, so they say that they are (insert religious preference or ethnic background). I have read books by Crowley, I joined Golden Dawn a long time ago, albeit it was mail order…I studied and learned…i realised to a very basic that point people are controlled and fooled by those who are in charge that magick is bad, living a natural life is bad yet, by them, magick is being worked upon us daily. How much mental energy is magick would you say and how much is physical, i’ve heard 90% is mental, i.e. illusion maybe? Hypnosis? I belive that the bible is one of the greatest learning tools in history, teaching enlightenment. On that same note, I believe that many pagans are living exactly the way our creator intends us to live. In my opinion there must be a bridge…do not listen to the church(christian), it is a system of control, do not practice your belief alone(pagan), listen to and respect the old world(wisdom). Please check out http://www.jordanmaxwell.com. I feel that he is mostly right in what his opinions and theories are. I appreciate this blog, and your insight and passion for justice. Thank you.
No religious revolution has ever occured (with the exception of Ireland) without war.
Wicca is less a secret to the public as it is within its own community, for example the passing on of the book of shadows.
As far as magick and wicca is concerned, you dont have to practice magick to be wiccan, in fact that is a dangerous assumtion, (after all, not all catholics are priests, and not all priests ought to be) When the world was dominatly pagan there were very few magick workers, a few shamans, a few priests/priestess’, etc. who took good care of their people, their people who were devote and loyal to the religion with no skill in magick whatsoever. secrecy comes from the fact that handing such power over to people who dont know how to use it is harmful to the inexpirienced user, and so is forbidden, no opinion nessessary, just forbidden, and also from a much simpler view point of money, if everyone knew how to cure the sick and open a circle, and see oracles, experienced witches in the old world would have starved to death trying to make a buck, imagine if strega nona’s magick pasta pot was a dime a dozan, she would not have convinced poor big anthony to tend her garden for sure
As far as a spell losing power with too much use… Energy cannot be created or destroyed, only manipulated, moved, shifted, changed, which is what magick seeks to do. When you shift energy you change the balance of a spell, especially when invoking the energy of God or Goddess perhaps you lose nothing, perhaps you do, but once the spell is finished, you have manipulated energy.
teach your children to love the Goddess and repect God. Read them Strega Nona, and books which respect witches and admire them, instead of the scarey images children are exposed to today, teach them about ST. Patrick and celebrate the Sabbats with them, that is how you change the current views of Wicca, not by pushing books. There are other organizations that do that door to door. The future of our faith is in the hands of the children……..most certainly not the internet, your coven or mine, or any organization in the world. Wicca is a way of life, and I fear more and more of us know spells better then the Gods and Goddess’ we invoke with them, better then the ideals of the religion.
Stevie,
First and foremost, I’m not looking to change the entire world into Pagans. I’m simply looking for the entire world to be okay with Pagans wearing pentagrams at work like it’s totally okay for a Christian to wear a cross. I want it to be okay for me to have a Pagan bumper sticker on my car in the Bible Belt. I want it to be okay for a coven to buy a building in the middle of town if they want to. No war should be necessary for equality to take place. I have said over and over again that I am not looking for people to convert to Paganism at all.
I really don’t know why you seem to think I’m talking about Wicca. I am not in the slight bit concerned with Wicca, I’m only concerned with magick. I also would like to stress that magick is not something that you learn overnight. There are basics that can be learned and understood in a couple days, yes, but to be truly familiar with magick it takes a while. So that means that the majority of people aren’t willing to devote the time and effort to learn it. It’s like saying, if we kept the information about fixing computers out in the open then everyone would know how to fix them and the Best Buy computer repair would go out of business. Oh wait, it is out in the open and they haven’t gone out of business.
I agree that energy cannot be created or destroyed. I also agree that energy can be shifted. So who cares if you shifted energy? You do it every day whenever you talk about something or wish for something. It’s unconscious, but it’s happening. So the only purpose of a spell is to shift the energy to do the work you want it to do. So what Jessica is talking about is that when you talk about that super cool initiation ritual you did last night, it takes some of the energy from the ritual and puts it into the conversation. That’s a common theory in almost all magickal systems, and from my experience is very true.
Okay, so what you’re saying is that we should sit back and accept the world as it is. Just like how if African Americans had simply sat back during the 50′s and 60′s that the Civil Rights movement would have come about. How about if Martin Luther King Jr. had said, “Nah, I’m not going to speak out against this, I’m just going to tell my kids that they shouldn’t hate other races.” I really can’t understand how that’s okay. Maybe I’m misinterpretting what you’re saying, but I really can’t agree with my interpretation of your comment.
Ananael,
I think that there’s been some kind of misunderstanding. I think that you may be misinterpretting several things. I’m not saying that I think that the techniques are supposed to be kept hidden. I am simply asking if there’s any reason to. I know that diplomatically and politically speaking, I don’t want to sound like Tom Cruise trying to explain Scientology on television and making a mockery of the entire thing. I don’t want us to hide what we believe, but I also don’t want to sound like a cult or a bunch of crazies to the average Joe.
I also think that you’re slightly misunderstanding Jessica’s comment because she’s obviously not talking about keeping techniques hidden. She’s talking about keeping that ritual you did last night hidden in order to keep from being attached to it. This sounds very similar to your ideas on the equation from Chaos Magick. So I’m guessing that you just misunderstood her.
I also have to agree with a lot of what Jessica said (which I think you do too looking at your past comments as well as your current one), but on the other hand, there’s another side to it:
Imagine that we’ve been doing research for the past 25 years and come up with a tried and true method of levitation (go with me here) or teleportation or some other absolutely incredible feat. Do you really want to let the knowledge out to everyone? Well on first hearing this, I’d say absolutely. But do you want everyone who starts researching magick to only be after these things? I’m not saying that I think we should hide everything, but I’m also saying that it’s something to think about. I once read a story about alchemists where the people that tried to create/find the philosopher’s stone and elixir of life never found it because they were only after the end result. The only ones that found it were the ones who embraced the process and they themselves changed as they pursued it. Isn’t magick an art as well as a science? Maybe by not having a goal, we pursue the art as well as the science?
It’s just something to think about.
Again, people are afraid of what they don’t know, and this runs both ways. Look how the media/hollywood has portrayed anything pagan or wiccan, not too pretty. And when you do see local media covering something pagan, yes usually around Halloween, they kinda shine the “nerd” light on us for being different.
It shouldn’t be secret, but it’s going to take a long time, a very long time, to be accepted as a whole. Of course acceptance doesn’t mean anything, look at christianity, they’ve recieved ton’s of black eyes, and how much more mainstream can you get….of course there churches are collapsing from within anyway. Organization can be the bane of all movements.
Peace and good luck,
“So after all of that, I would like to know if there is really any valid reason why people should keep their practices secret.”
Honestly amigo, from my point of view, the reason why people are not more open about their rituals and practice is because of the comments from other folks.
In passing I have personally heard this within the last 4 months;
- between two guys in a locker room discussing a guy who had a pentagram tatooed on his back shoulder blade that had just walked out;
“what was that tatoo?,
one of those devils or wiccan thing/symbols I think,
what a weirdo, why would anyone believe that garbage?, beats me, but he is going to hell”
Despite wicca being a ‘recognized religion’, people will STILL, in their communities and schools, ostracize those who are perceived as being ‘different’. And those folks who are pagan, wiccan, or whatever probably don’t want to deal with that.
I am not by any means saying it is right, I depsise that it is that way and I dream of a day when everyone is willing to look at their fellow being and not judge them by their religious preference or body type.
If this is not what you were talking about then my apologies.
~Rob
MFTRW,
My comment wasn’t a response to Jessica’s post. I was more addressing various attitudes regarding secrecy that I have personally seen around the magical community over the years. I did not intend to imply that I think Jessica was being “silly” or “ridiculous,” and I’m sorry if my comment came off that way. One of the things I like about Blogger over WordPress is that you can respond to specific posts and the responses show up threaded, which keeps the conversation a little clearer.
And actually, I think it’s great if you get into magick because you want to be able to levitate, or cast lightning bolts, or whatever – because it means you are getting into magick. If wanting to do cool tricks motivates you to be disciplined about your practice you’ll arrive at the end result of the path anyway. Practical magick doesn’t work if you can’t expand your consciousness, and once you expand your consciousness you’re well on your way to enlightenment.
I’ve read the blog, and understand what you’re saying and what you wish to accomplish.
I’ve read all the comments and digested the feelings and understand what people are saying and thinking.
True, anyone can pick up a book and learn about witchcraft and magick. True, people will frown at our religion, make rude and nasty comments about us and maybe even hurt us (emotionally and physically) for the choice we’ve made.
Many people believe that the less said about our religion the better in that it is the best way to avoid the critizisms. Some people have family members that just wouldn’t understand and refuse to listen or accept our choice when we tried to explain it to them. I fit into this catagory. While raised Southern Baptist, I was always the one asking the odd questions… “Why do we not celebrate Passover when in the bible it states that EVERYONE should celebrate Passover?” and “If God made Adam and Eve in his own likeness, how did he come up with a female counterpart? Is God a male AND a female?”
I felt out of place at church. Things just didn’t make sense to me. I started learning about witchcraft when I was in high school. All by myself, alone with several books I had purchased secretly. If my parents had found my books, I would have been punished severly. I think that has stayed with me my whole life. The general population just doesn’t understand.
While I know that you wish our religion to be as common place as the Southern Baptist religion is, you have to remember that the Salem Witch Trials are a strong part of our National History and it has a strong forebarence on the current thoughts of our choosen religion. It will take a very long time for our religion to be able to stand up next to the Catholics, the Baptists, the Jewish and the Muslim.
I’m not trying to dash hopes here. Some day it will happen… more and more people are joining our religion all the time. I just don’t think it will happen in my lifetime. Of course, I’m 41 now and so don’t really think it will happen in my kids’ lifetime either. I think baby steps is the answer. However, I’m with you 100% of the way.
If I have done a spell, I will keep it secret until it works. However, anything else I know, what I do and have done and how I do it I’m fine with telling people. I personally feel keeping a running spell secret keeps it more special and allows me to focus on it more for it to work. Other than that, tell all. How will they find out if not told. The only thing is, you have to be brave enough to withstand the ridicule of peers and teachers if you decide to answer them in class as I tend to do when someone announces I’m Pagan. Most of them are fine with it but there’s one or two who’ll never stop having a go.
Also, to add to that, I think it varies by place. Most of you look like you’re in America, judging from times posted and childhoods in Baptist areas, whilst I’m in England where on the whole they just don’t care.
I have a reason for keeping my magic to myself, within reason.
I believe that magic is largely possible because of “glitches in the programming”, so to speak. However, scrutiny and skepticism are the “debuggers” of the programming. So, in my experience, to draw attention to those glitches makes it harder to achieve them, and makes them less likely to have any major effect.
So, I don’t hide that I practice magic, and I don’t refuse advice or insight to those who would seek it, but I never ever tell anyone WHEN I am working a spell, or what it is for, until my results are achieved.